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Post by sree on Nov 27, 2022 15:24:18 GMT -5
I remember that video It didn't strike me as a political, and it seemed to have a wider reach than being about the leading politicians' "stupidity". In this video Tolle contrasts stupidity with wisdom, not with intelligence. He expresses the belief that what's happening isn't the result of a widely reaching conspiracy, in spite of various groups' and individuals' trying to take advantage. Well, he compliments Russell on his challenging of 'insane people' (he even used the word 'monsters'), he talked of what 'politicians and media are doing', he spoke of the invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan, biological warfare, he speaks of 'interest groups that manipulate events', there's an acknowledgement of a 'Great Reset'..... it's all very political, and it's condemnation its own way. But as you say, it's condemnation of their 'stupidity' rather than their 'evil nature'. My view is that the powerful people/groups in the world do conspire together to protect and consolidate their interests, and I don't consider that a 'theory', because I see a ton of evidence of that. The only question for me is how MUCH they conspire i.e to what extent they act opportunistically, and to what extent these events are planned. I agree with Tolle that these people are devoid of wisdom, but they are intellectually smart in some cases. I think all events are planned except that there are no planners. The planning is a movement predetermined by conditions set up by previous conditions. Ted Kaczynski (unabomber) went to great lengths to warn us of the path we are going down. Even a watered down version of his "manifesto" in Wikipedia would tell you that your view of the world is not unreasonable.
How new are your computer and handphone? They are now our primary tools to live by. The SVP is a psychological entity that is hooked up to technology. Our pace of life continues to move faster with every upgrade and advancement of pace of living.
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Post by laughter on Nov 27, 2022 15:25:23 GMT -5
Hi all, I studied political science but did not pursue an academic career. Sometimes I think about researching and writing a paper, just for fun, and one of the topics that occasionally comes to mind is "political views of spiritual teachers". Since I'll probably never put in the effort to actually research it properly, I thought it would be fun to pose the question here. So: What are the political views of spiritual teachers you are acquainted with? Eckhart Tolle recently talked with Russell Brand, and in his own way, expressed a quite strong political view (he basically called the leading politicians of the world 'stupid'). It's an interesting question you raise, because prior to 2020, it was semi-easy for spiritual teachers to avoid the minefield of politics if they wanted to. It's become more difficult in recent years, for example, last year Spira held a meeting in which only vaccinated people could attend, which is taking a political position, whether he wants to take one or not. I would actually argue that we can't be in this world, without being political in some way, shape or form, but prior to 2020, this was less obvious, or relevant. So while I think many teachers would rather continue to avoid taking political positions, given the state of the world today, it can rarely be avoided (there may be some exceptions). Where one shops is a political statement. Whether one uses petrol or electric is a political statement. But it's why I appreciate Tolle being willing to actually talk about it, and openly take a position of sorts. Better perhaps to deal with the current state, than to avoid it. (Sree likes this post  ) Saw that. It made me chuckle. My impression of the imp was that he was thinking " whoa! I warned them about this in New Earth! Holy Shit!  " ..  .. I'm pretty sure he wasn't taking a side, but rather, just commenting on the madness being expressed by the extremity of the opposing sides. |
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Post by sree on Nov 27, 2022 15:31:04 GMT -5
All species except humans impose an age limit set by God.
In the wild, males don't hump females unless they are on heat. just because humans are smarter than anything else doesnt set us apart Doesn't set us apart from what? Do you seriously think humping a two-year old makes you smarter than a rabbit?
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Post by andrew on Nov 27, 2022 15:35:27 GMT -5
Well, he compliments Russell on his challenging of 'insane people' (he even used the word 'monsters'), he talked of what 'politicians and media are doing', he spoke of the invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan, biological warfare, he speaks of 'interest groups that manipulate events', there's an acknowledgement of a 'Great Reset'..... it's all very political, and it's condemnation its own way. But as you say, it's condemnation of their 'stupidity' rather than their 'evil nature'. My view is that the powerful people/groups in the world do conspire together to protect and consolidate their interests, and I don't consider that a 'theory', because I see a ton of evidence of that. The only question for me is how MUCH they conspire i.e to what extent they act opportunistically, and to what extent these events are planned. I agree with Tolle that these people are devoid of wisdom, but they are intellectually smart in some cases. I think all events are planned except that there are no planners. The planning is a movement predetermined by conditions set up by previous conditions. Ted Kaczynski (unabomber) went to great lengths to warn us of the path we are going down. Even a watered down version of his "manifesto" in Wikipedia would tell you that your view of the world is not unreasonable.
How new are your computer and handphone? They are now our primary tools to live by. The SVP is a psychological entity that is hooked up to technology. Our pace of life continues to move faster with every upgrade and advancement of pace of living.
Yes, this is the 'everything moves as one' position. The 'choiceless' position. I broadly agree with it, though I would say that where there is planning, there are planners. That doesn't mean that they have a 'choice' about what they plan. This is a theme that was discussed over thousands and thousands of pages a few years ago. You would probably have enjoyed the forum at the time, it was very dynamic. In one way, I see the very worst people (the Ted Bundy's of the world) as being like vortices or conduits of evil. They draw in the negative shadow of the world, and then express it in grotesque ways. But it can be argued that they too are acting in service by transmuting the broader evil of the world. That doesn't make their actions 'right'....anything of that sort is deeply wrong, but it doesn't mean that I believe they should burn in hell for it. |
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Post by andrew on Nov 27, 2022 15:40:07 GMT -5
Eckhart Tolle recently talked with Russell Brand, and in his own way, expressed a quite strong political view (he basically called the leading politicians of the world 'stupid'). It's an interesting question you raise, because prior to 2020, it was semi-easy for spiritual teachers to avoid the minefield of politics if they wanted to. It's become more difficult in recent years, for example, last year Spira held a meeting in which only vaccinated people could attend, which is taking a political position, whether he wants to take one or not. I would actually argue that we can't be in this world, without being political in some way, shape or form, but prior to 2020, this was less obvious, or relevant. So while I think many teachers would rather continue to avoid taking political positions, given the state of the world today, it can rarely be avoided (there may be some exceptions). Where one shops is a political statement. Whether one uses petrol or electric is a political statement. But it's why I appreciate Tolle being willing to actually talk about it, and openly take a position of sorts. Better perhaps to deal with the current state, than to avoid it. (Sree likes this post ) Saw that. It made me chuckle. My impression of the imp was that he was thinking " whoa! I warned them about this in New Earth! Holy Shit! " .. .. I'm pretty sure he wasn't taking a side, but rather, just commenting on the madness being expressed by the extremity of the opposing sides. haha yeah I had that thought about 'New Earth' too. He doesn't have a smug or self-righteous bone in his body, but I allowed myself to feel it for him just a touch |
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Post by laughter on Nov 27, 2022 15:43:38 GMT -5
I believe both sides (left and right) contain shadows and aspects of existential truth. The left value practical co-operation and compassion (over competition) which is a shadow of unity consciousness and oneness. The right value sovereignty and freedom (over regulation and control) which is a shadow of existential beingness. Up until 2020, I leaned more left than right, because I believed the leftist shadows benefitted the world more. But in the last couple of years, it seems to me that what is intrinsically good about the left has been buried beneath toxic authoritarianism and control (not just in America, but all around the world). For some on the left, the want for co-operation has morphed into a want to punish perceived enemies, and compassion has become intolerance for what does not fit their world-view. As part of that, sovereignty and freedom have been unhealthily demonized. But maybe that's been changing again recently. My ideal is that we will come into balance, heal the division, and move forward with the very best of both sides (include and go beyond) Yes, the best lies have just enough truth woven through their fabric in just the right way to make them believable. Seems to me that we may be living through a time that might result in a sort of ideological realignment where the meanings of the old polarities eventually lose their usefulness. |
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Post by inavalan on Nov 27, 2022 15:48:02 GMT -5
Anyone here know the basic tenets and beliefs of QAnonism? It looks like you are asking as a joke, but I thought about it. Wasn't it fundamentally driven by Christian ethics i.e a belief in God and the bible, the American constitution, traditional Christian morality (good vs evil), conservative values and structures e.g nuclear family, protestant work ethic, the right to bear arms etc. I just used search engine....yeah, it looks like I'm on the right lines. And at the opposite end of the spectrum, we have the atheist/humanist/materialist movement that underpins transhumanism (the merging of the biological with the digital). Your good-sense reply reminds that last evening a relative said " how can they be against immigrants; we're all immigrants". As Tolle pointed in his Brand video (by the way, I don't follow Tolle, and I don't subscribe to his spiritual views; nor Brand's for that matter), apparently intelligent people don't see things wisely, they are unconsciously misled (hypnotized) by their sources or information. In the discussion about immigration, the "opposers" object to illegal and chaotic immigration, because it is a threat to country's security, and citizens' welfare. But, in many cases, you can't "open" others' minds. They could do that only themselves. |
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Post by andrew on Nov 27, 2022 16:05:24 GMT -5
It looks like you are asking as a joke, but I thought about it. Wasn't it fundamentally driven by Christian ethics i.e a belief in God and the bible, the American constitution, traditional Christian morality (good vs evil), conservative values and structures e.g nuclear family, protestant work ethic, the right to bear arms etc. I just used search engine....yeah, it looks like I'm on the right lines. And at the opposite end of the spectrum, we have the atheist/humanist/materialist movement that underpins transhumanism (the merging of the biological with the digital). Your good-sense reply reminds that last evening a relative said "[i ]how can they be against immigrants; we're all immigrants[/i]". [/b] As Tolle pointed in his Brand video (by the way, I don't follow Tolle, and I don't subscribe to his spiritual views; nor Brand's for that matter), apparently intelligent people don't see things wisely, they are unconsciously misled (hypnotized) by their sources or information. I n the discussion about immigration, the "opposers" object to illegal and chaotic immigration, because it is a threat to country's security, and citizens' welfare.But, in many cases, you can't "open" others' minds. They could do that only themselves. [/quote] Yes, that is a good example of how things get twisted. |
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Post by andrew on Nov 27, 2022 16:11:02 GMT -5
Maybe you draw the boundary of your circle a lot smaller than me (but I do know people that were abused as children) We can say that it's all God, it's all Divine, it's all Love. I get what is meant by 'perfection'. I understand the relative aspect of 'right and wrong'. And yet I would say that 'deeply wrong' can still exist in conjunction with all that. Being present in the moment includes 'deeply wrong', and there are contextual limits as to how far we can assassinate 'wrongness'. In the world we are living in today, there's really no avoiding taking political positions to some extent, because it's a politicized world. That's just the way it is right now. You've taken one here...a strong one. the world will never be to your liking you will remain dissatisfed the rest of your life Thanks for the blessing I'd rather be dissatisfied with certain things in my attention, and be conscious of that dissatisfaction, than mentally-emotionally contort my way into satisfaction with those certain things. It serves me creatively to pay attention to my felt senses. Have you been satisfied with this conversation? |
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Post by andrew on Nov 27, 2022 16:20:09 GMT -5
Thanks for the blessing I'd rather be dissatisfied with certain things in my attention, and be conscious of that dissatisfaction, than mentally-emotionally contort my way into satisfaction with those certain things. It serves me creatively to pay attention to my felt senses. Have you been satisfied with this conversation? no, but it always fine to talk with you Andrew  That comes across as a Farmer I know, and it satisfies me  Thank you. |
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Post by inavalan on Nov 27, 2022 16:31:21 GMT -5
got a huge problem with pedohilia in your immediate circle? yeah, me neither Maybe you draw the boundary of your circle a lot smaller than me (but I do know people that were abused as children) We can say that it's all God, it's all Divine, it's all Love. I get what is meant by 'perfection'. I understand the relative aspect of 'right and wrong'. And yet I would say that 'deeply wrong' can still exist in conjunction with all that. Being present in the moment includes 'deeply wrong', and there are contextual limits as to how far we can assassinate 'wrongness'. In the world we are living in today, there's really no avoiding taking political positions to some extent, because it's a politicized world. That's just the way it is right now. You've taken one here...a strong one. I think that this applies to this discussion:  |
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Post by andrew on Nov 27, 2022 16:39:37 GMT -5
That comes across as a Farmer I know, and it satisfies me Thank you. there is no way to explain dude... although 'exactly the same but minus the thoughts' might express the situation which, as far as I can tell, means uninterupted contentment.. and certainly not wanting anything to be different from what it is.. Though as you said, this conversation didn't satisfy you i.e is wasn't uninterrupted contentment! Where you are 'at' right now on your spiritual journey is right for you, just as where I am 'at' right now on my spiritual journey is right for me. There's no 'ubiquitously right' way |
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Post by andrew on Nov 27, 2022 16:49:55 GMT -5
Maybe you draw the boundary of your circle a lot smaller than me (but I do know people that were abused as children) We can say that it's all God, it's all Divine, it's all Love. I get what is meant by 'perfection'. I understand the relative aspect of 'right and wrong'. And yet I would say that 'deeply wrong' can still exist in conjunction with all that. Being present in the moment includes 'deeply wrong', and there are contextual limits as to how far we can assassinate 'wrongness'. In the world we are living in today, there's really no avoiding taking political positions to some extent, because it's a politicized world. That's just the way it is right now. You've taken one here...a strong one. I think that this applies to this discussion: Yes. One incredible thing about the world right now, is that so many folks are in positions in which it is necessary for them to consider their values, and be conscious of what they stand for. It makes for a contentious world, but I believe it's just expressing our self-explorations. |
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Post by andrew on Nov 27, 2022 16:53:55 GMT -5
Though as you said, this conversation didn't satisfy you i.e is wasn't uninterrupted contentment! Where you are 'at' right now on your spiritual journey is right for you, just as where I am 'at' right now on my spiritual journey is right for me. There's no 'ubiquitously right' way if you're good all the time.. cool If a British person said they were good all the time, I'd be concerned I'm as good, as is appropriate for me to be, and that's good enough |
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Post by laughter on Nov 27, 2022 17:23:29 GMT -5
Sure there is. Raping kids is deeply wrong. You sure you aren't part of a cult? (with Robert)? males hump females, of all ages. same as it ever was does any other species impose an age limit? Male lions just cut to the chase and snap the necks of the other guys cubs.  |
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" .. 
.. I'm pretty sure he wasn't taking a side, but rather, just commenting on the madness being expressed by the extremity of the opposing sides.
