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Post by zendancer on Oct 29, 2022 17:13:56 GMT -5
There is no movement from point A to point B because there is no point B except in imagination. There is also no separate volitional entity who does anything; that's the fundamental illusion underlying all other cognitive illusions. As for whether ATA-T is or isn't useful, one can experiment and find out. No need to take someone else's word for anything.  Ok, then. Please set up an experiment for us to find out. The experiment is performed within one's own consciousness. Go for a walk and find out if you can look at the world in mental silence (no mind talk). If so, what's the difference between what's seen and what it is that one imagines is seen? If not, then keep shifting attention away from thoughts to direct sensory perception until it becomes clear what the difference is. This experiment requires some persistence, but it can lead to a significant insight. |
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Post by zendancer on Oct 29, 2022 17:25:47 GMT -5
That's the meaning of individuation. It's not going to for the Whole all at once. We traveled this months ago. Looks like you are a Theravada guy moving one step at a time. A Zen believes in love at first sight. Maybe not first sight, but I met my wife on a blind date and asked her to marry me on the third date.  |
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Post by sree on Oct 29, 2022 19:38:06 GMT -5
Looks like you are a Theravada guy moving one step at a time. A Zen believes in love at first sight. Maybe not first sight, but I met my wife on a blind date and asked her to marry me on the third date. Sorry, man. If it's not first sight, you were not struck by magic.
And if one is struck by magic, love must be consummated at first sight before thought. Anything else, after thought has entered the relationship, it is conscious carnality sullied by the actor. Not good.
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Post by sree on Oct 29, 2022 22:39:55 GMT -5
Ok, then. Please set up an experiment for us to find out. Go for a walk and find out if you can look at the world in mental silence (no mind talk). If so, what's the difference between what's seen and what it is that one imagines is seen? If not, then keep shifting attention away from thoughts to direct sensory perception until it becomes clear what the difference is. This experiment requires some persistence, but it can lead to a significant insight. Are you serious? If what you say is for real, then there is no reason for more than one person in existence.
The Little Prince was stranded on a planet sitting under a Baobob tree all alone by himself. And that is the primal fear of being alone in the universe. Don’t you get it? This is the reason why babies cry. They are afraid. When I was really, really small as a baby, when I woke up and my mom wasn’t there, I freaked out because I felt I had to survive alone.
Your experiment is an unreal contrivance of the mind. |
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Post by inavalan on Oct 29, 2022 23:14:43 GMT -5
I think that consulting the I Ching can be a valuable way of accessing inner-guidance. In my experience, the I Ching works well in most cases. Surely, that depends on what it is expected to deliver, how it is approached. I recall situations in which some time later I realized that it was I who misinterpreted the guidance. Why the I Ching works, what inner-guidance is, what's its role, ... I have a working model. I rather liked I-Ching studies back when. They did help me to break out of the constrictive conditioned thought patterns that I had fallen in the trap of. Due to my background and love of nature, the intuition required and archetypes it used seemed to help me turn inward and search for the 'trust' that was I was just beginning to notice emerging from within. A little challenging to explain, so I'll leave it there for now. I didn't go into it deeply (and the internet was not available then), so one of the things that always flummoxed me was the use of 'directions' (i.e., east-west-north-south). I feel compelled to look into it, but before I do, maybe you or Dusty can provide some insight on how/what they reference architypically. Curious. In the I Ching readings, I've generally interpreted "east-west-north-south" ad litteram: the cardinal points of the compass, in relation to the inquirer's location. But, as the readings are intuitively interpreted, I imagine that those directions could symbolize something else, or might even be overlooked in certain inquiries. Offhand, I recall that there is at lest one hexagram that points to South-West as a favorable direction to relocate, but it probably attracted my attention because I subjectively observed that in many cities, the better neighborhoods are located on their West side. |
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Post by inavalan on Oct 30, 2022 0:29:10 GMT -5
I think that consulting the I Ching can be a valuable way of accessing inner-guidance. In my experience, the I Ching works well in most cases. Surely, that depends on what it is expected to deliver, how it is approached. I recall situations in which some time later I realized that it was I who misinterpreted the guidance. Why the I Ching works, what inner-guidance is, what's its role, ... I have a working model.if you would be willing, i'd like to hear. I think that consulting the I Ching can be a valuable way of accessing inner-guidance. In my experience, the I Ching works well in most cases. Surely, that depends on what it is expected to deliver, how it is approached. I recall situations in which some time later I realized that it was I who misinterpreted the guidance. Why the I Ching works, what inner-guidance is, what's its role, ... I have a working model. Law of Attraction? The I Ching works because it gives the awake you access to actual probabilistic information, beyond the current point in space and time. The "present" hexagram represents, from that perspective, the current situation more comprehensively than you can assess it through your regular five physical senses. The "future" hexagram represents the perception of those probable futures. The "changing lines" are optimized paths of action for you (only for you), free-will optimum choices in the context of those probabilities. This kind of inner-guidance is the accessing of that probabilistic information, with parts of your personality that are inhibited while in the waking state. At your personality's current level of development, you aren't able to consciously handle that amount of perceptions. (Not all personalities are at the same level of development, and abilities need to be developed, and improved.) When you consult the I Ching, you access that information, and interpret it at the current level of your abilities. As I understand it, the way of moving through the probabilities (in terms of space and time too) is a matter of consecutive choices, not of creating something from nothing, nor of attracting something created by a source, neither of reacting to what others do. This explains why making inquiries about something happening or not, or that requires a yes / no answer should be avoided. Nothing is fixed, nothing is unavoidable, nothing is accidental, nothing depends on others than yourself, but most of us aren't able to better handle reality (yet). |
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Post by laughter on Oct 30, 2022 0:50:56 GMT -5
Thanks. This helps to better triangulate what you're on about. It also presents a little more sincere clarity on your take in the previous rendered 'word salad' (when juxtaposed to the rest of the utterance). As for this, how can KNOWING what you are be mysterious? Are you not yet comfortable with TRUTH, or is the attention still carried away by mind's protestations? Your conclusions presented here follow a familiar path that many were left stranded by when biting JK's finger. Existentially, are you stranded/suffering, or comfortable? NOTHING is unexplainable. EVERYTHING is a mystery. Enter the Niz quote on NOTHING and EVERYTHING for some nice pondering in the flow. Does it? Are you on the same page as me, in the same dimension, of the same world? I live in a world where the body needs food and vulnerable to physical violence.
Existentially, I suffer a constant low level of anxiety because of an unstable world that poses a threat to my body.
Becoming conscious of that anxiety is an excellent opportunity, and I'm not suggesting to waste that opportunity on self-improvement. |
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Post by laughter on Oct 30, 2022 0:57:06 GMT -5
Okay. You mentioned (perhaps as a joke) reincarnation. So I asked you what identity existed that could reincarnate. Here you seem to say: none; there is no reincarnation, no eternal individual soul to reincarnate. Okay. If that's the truth, the vast majority of humanity cannot accept it and breeds all kinds of religious and spiritual ideas to hide from it. I'm skeptical that you have accepted it and view it like throwing out a "name card". I think we have deeper attachment to our "self" than that.
Your skepticism is well-founded. What I am attached to is not the “name card” we pin to the “self”. I am attached to this mysterious wonder from which springs every magical thing in life. The blue sky is pure magic if you don’t wreck it with the belief that light is a spectrum of colors and blue light is scattered more by Earth’s atmosphere because it has the shortest wavelength. The two guys here who swear by this belief are science aficionado stardust, and our resident scientist, zendancer. more poetry |
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Post by inavalan on Oct 30, 2022 0:59:44 GMT -5
Thanks, this works very well. "The way I understand this to work, you should get better results if you concentrate yourself on your problem, and do the draw." That's the most important part! You can adjust your focus of awareness, both in direction and in range, so you can project and access parts of another personality to some degree, function of your abilities, and depending if the other personality doesn't prevent it. Edgar Cayce and others did / do it, interpreting it as Akashic Records or otherwise. For example, you can remotely do hypnoanalysis, healing, regressions; remotely both in space and time (even probabilistically). You can consult the I Ching too for another, with his knowledge or not. I haven't consulted the I Ching lately, as I didn't feel the need. After the last couple of draws I posted here, I'm kind of curious to experiment a little ... out of curiosity. It is like trying to interpret others' night-dreams for them, or trying to find out the cause of others' ailments and fixes for them, with or without their knowledge. Out of curiosity, I made the following inquiries: For a better interpretation of the readings, I prefer R. L. Wing's book. |
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Post by laughter on Oct 30, 2022 1:05:20 GMT -5
Anyone who wants to find the truth must go beyond the intellect. The intellect only deals with images, ideas, and symbols, so it only deals with the known. To find what lies beyond the known (what Jesus called "the living truth"), one must, in the words of Jacob Boehm, "throw oneself into that where no creature dwelleth." Best wishes. Although I have always claimed that beyond the intellect there isn't any truth ...  That's like a sort of shadow visible to intellect: "the truth is that there is no truth".  ha! ha! bring on the dancing hamsters! |
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Post by inavalan on Oct 30, 2022 1:07:01 GMT -5
What will be the impact on the United States of its midterm elections of November 2022REPAIR (Decay) >>> MODERATION (Modesty) 18 (2,6) 15   
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Post by laughter on Oct 30, 2022 1:11:40 GMT -5
Although I have always claimed that beyond the intellect there isn't any truth ... Beyond the intellect is the unknown where truth can be found, said zendancer. And you say that truth is within the the grasp of the intellect. So, could his kind of truth be out there, and your kind of truth is within the world we know? Another shadow visible to the intellect, but this one perhaps with the potential to point away from a TMT loop rather than incite one. I first read this in Heisenberg's one and only metaphysical book (that I know of). The unknown and the known are each infinities, each limitless, but the unknown will always be the greater of the two. Put another way, any question that science answers will always ever result in more new questions. Ineffability puts the mind on notice. What does the mind make of this notice? Well ... |
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Post by inavalan on Oct 30, 2022 1:13:12 GMT -5
How will the covid pandemic fare over the next six months in the United States?TRAVELING >>> SOVEREIGNTY (Possession in Great Measure) 56 (1,2) 14   
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Post by laughter on Oct 30, 2022 1:17:34 GMT -5
Beyond the intellect is the unknown where truth can be found, said zendancer. And you say that truth is within the the grasp of the intellect. So, could his kind of truth be out there, and your kind of truth is within the world we know? Truth is intellectually based . You know what truth means derivers from the intellect associating what something is to be that . There is no truth beyond the thought of it . It's one of those pointer thingies . Non conceptual truths make me gag Like the stench of a wet dog in from the rain, perhaps??  |
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Post by inavalan on Oct 30, 2022 1:19:20 GMT -5
How will the Ukraine war fare over the next one year?RESOLUTION 43 (unchanged)  
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