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Post by Deleted on Sept 17, 2021 23:33:11 GMT -5
Ok. I think I made my point. As I stated before, I see no point in arguing. That's called preaching. Investigating Consciousness after the five senses have been retracted-back into the pineal is a interesting to explore inavalan. Are you an explorer?
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Post by inavalan on Sept 18, 2021 0:02:16 GMT -5
Ok. I think I made my point. As I stated before, I see no point in arguing. That's called preaching. I don't follow ... "preaching" - the delivery of a sermon or religious address to an assembled group of people, typically in church.
"large numbers of people would come to hear his preaching"
- the giving of moral advice in a pompously self-righteous way.
"your preaching won't make me change my mind"
None was my intention. I just see no point in arguing, as there is nothing you or anybody else could say that would make me take your word over my inner guidance. No offense intended. Are you saying that you were "preaching" to me? That would make no impression on me. Sorry to disappoint.
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Post by inavalan on Sept 18, 2021 0:13:24 GMT -5
Investigating Consciousness after the five senses have been retracted-back into the pineal is a interesting to explore inavalan. Are you an explorer?If I understand what you meant, you made an interesting point ... While I think that the pineal gland's role is a matter of beliefs I don't subscribe to, I believe that our subconscious creates the reality that our senses perceive, and distort. So we can / could perceive a less distorted reality if we used our inner senses. Also, your question about being an explorer was probably meant differently than I understood it. To me your question has a deeper meaning.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 18, 2021 0:35:32 GMT -5
Investigating Consciousness after the five senses have been retracted-back into the pineal is interesting to explore inavalan. Are you an explorer?If I understand what you meant, you made an interesting point ... While I think that the pineal gland's role is a matter of beliefs I don't subscribe to, I believe that our subconscious creates the reality that our senses perceive, and distort. So we can / could perceive a less distorted reality if we used our inner senses. Also, your question about being an explorer was probably meant differently than I understood it. To me your question has a deeper meaning. In medicine the proffession doesnt know much at all. (beliefs)
Diving into the subconscious I found revealing when focussing on my body. (I Am my subconscious)
I suspect the 'inner senses' you mention maybe those I found on the otherside of the Pineal. Before this realisation, my Intuition lead me into a practice I found many years later was being taught within the Sufi Tradition. Ty for picking up on me.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 18, 2021 0:52:01 GMT -5
Zd is correct. Acting half heartedly brings about nothing-afresh. Understanding ones own Being is important. Nature is being, most humans being lodged in their cranium. Nature has no brain yet flows through seasons fruiting at the right time. After studying a complex situation, creative architects (having taken a clients brief into their mind) returns to the centre of gravity to do their work/play and the complex design is resolved magically. Yes. Seeing anybody who does their job well is a beautiful thing. The more complex the job the more beautiful. feelingbuddhaful.com/chuang-tzu-story/lovely story at the Com.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 18, 2021 0:55:59 GMT -5
Yes, agree, last paragraph. To simplify, All That Is, is a cross, the vertical and the horizontal, simultaneously. The horizontal is a movement in time, most humans know only-time. But eternity is always vertically infinite to each passing moment of time. Our Now is where the vertical and horizontal meet. you and your godd@mned models! Lol, If you have been into traditional philosophy Laughter let me know. one of my sons may wanna relate.
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Post by Reefs on Sept 18, 2021 1:10:22 GMT -5
I don't follow ... "preaching" - the delivery of a sermon or religious address to an assembled group of people, typically in church.
"large numbers of people would come to hear his preaching"
- the giving of moral advice in a pompously self-righteous way.
"your preaching won't make me change my mind"
None was my intention. I just see no point in arguing, as there is nothing you or anybody else could say that would make me take your word over my inner guidance. No offense intended. Are you saying that you were "preaching" to me? That would make no impression on me. Sorry to disappoint. Preaching as in 'dogmatic', as in 'I don't want to even consider if there could be other valid points of view out there', as in 'I don't have the slightest clue or reference or even interest in what these people here are talking about, but let me just throw in what my spiritual guides have told me'... I'm just wondering what you are doing here. If you are just interested in stating your opinions and don't want them to be questioned, then I'd say you'd be far better off spending your time on a personal blog (ideally, with comment function disabled) than on a discussion forum.
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Post by Reefs on Sept 18, 2021 1:25:35 GMT -5
Investigating Consciousness after the five senses have been retracted-back into the pineal is a interesting to explore inavalan. Are you an explorer?Absolutely! But Inavalan behaves a bit like scared fish in a pond. And that eternal elusiveness keeps one fascinated only for so long, until there are other, more rewarding objects of attention.
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Post by inavalan on Sept 18, 2021 2:14:49 GMT -5
I don't follow ... "preaching" - the delivery of a sermon or religious address to an assembled group of people, typically in church.
"large numbers of people would come to hear his preaching"
- the giving of moral advice in a pompously self-righteous way.
"your preaching won't make me change my mind"
None was my intention. I just see no point in arguing, as there is nothing you or anybody else could say that would make me take your word over my inner guidance. No offense intended. Are you saying that you were "preaching" to me? That would make no impression on me. Sorry to disappoint. Preaching as in 'dogmatic', as in 'I don't want to even consider if there could be other valid points of view out there', as in 'I don't have the slightest clue or reference or even interest in what these people here are talking about, but let me just throw in what my spiritual guides have told me'... I'm just wondering what you are doing here. If you are just interested in stating your opinions and don't want them to be questioned, then I'd say you'd be far better off spending your time on a personal blog (ideally, with comment function disabled) than on a discussion forum. dogmatic = inclined to lay down principles as incontrovertibly trueSo I think that you calling me "dogmatic" is ridiculous. I repeatedly stated that I don't consider that my views are "incontrovertibly true", just that they aren't based on rationalization, so nobody can convince me with arguments that my views are incorrect. That isn't "dogmatic", nor "preaching". You guys are stating that you know the truth, which I contest, but I don't try to change that because I know I can't. Occasionally I had interesting exchanges. Occasionally I interpreted a quote, or reference differently than it was presented here, and it confirmed my views. In balance, ... Anyway.
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Post by Reefs on Sept 18, 2021 2:32:37 GMT -5
Zd is correct. Acting half heartedly brings about nothing-afresh. Understanding ones own Being is important. Nature is being, most humans being lodged in their cranium. Nature has no brain yet flows through seasons fruiting at the right time. After studying a complex situation, creative architects (having taken a clients brief into their mind) returns to the centre of gravity to do their work/play and the complex design is resolved magically. Yes. Seeing anybody who does their job well is a beautiful thing. The more complex the job the more beautiful. feelingbuddhaful.com/chuang-tzu-story/Yes! Flow, alignment! If they've got something strong going on, they suck you right into their vortex of awesomeness. There are tons of videos on youtube that show people with extraordinary skill level, just search for "people are awesome"... I absolutely love those videos. Always reminds me of the Zhuangzi story about the cook and his knife that he used for twenty years. He was just an ordinary cook with an ordinary knife, but when he worked, he was in total alignment with the present moment and what he was doing, so that he was operating on a totally different level than all the other cooks who had to get a new knife every few months because they were not in alignment and had to put in effort. You can see that especially with athletes when they are in the zone and at the top of their game, they move with such ease, speed, skill and precision that it almost seems as if the laws of gravity or physics in general don't apply to them anymore. In such moments of total alignment, when your skill level perfectly matches the task/challenge at hand, when you are at one with this moment, in love with this moment, in love with life, not limited by your personal human perspective anymore, but seeing thru the eyes of Source and not acting as a human being anymore but as Source, Source acting thru you, consciously, when all is well in your world, that's what it means in practical terms, when the Infinite realizes itself as the Infinite thru the eyes of the Infinite, and that's the state of being I was getting at when I asked "Does anyone here feel invincible?" Because in those moments, you truly are.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 18, 2021 2:52:30 GMT -5
Investigating Consciousness after the five senses have been retracted-back into the pineal is a interesting to explore inavalan. Are you an explorer?Absolutely! But Inavalan behaves a bit like scared fish in a pond. And that eternal elusiveness keeps one fascinated only for so long, until there are other, more rewarding objects of attention. If that be the case, keeping a fish in a bowl with a stick placed in the center
will assure him a longer-life than fish in bowls
without a stick to focus-upon. So long as we are NOT trying to help others
nil arguments arise: Then magic has a chance to happen.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 18, 2021 3:09:48 GMT -5
Yes! Flow, alignment! If they've got something strong going on, they suck you right into their vortex of awesomeness. There are tons of videos on youtube that show people with extraordinary skill level, just search for "people are awesome"... I absolutely love those videos. Always reminds me of the Zhuangzi story about the cook and his knife that he used for twenty years. He was just an ordinary cook with an ordinary knife, but when he worked, he was in total alignment with the present moment and what he was doing, so that he was operating on a totally different level than all the other cooks who had to get a new knife every few months because they were not in alignment and had to put in effort. You can see that especially with athletes when they are in the zone and at the top of their game, they move with such ease, speed, skill and precision that it almost seems as if the laws of gravity or physics in general don't apply to them anymore. In such moments of total alignment, when your skill level perfectly matches the task/challenge at hand, when you are at one with this moment, in love with this moment, in love with life, not limited by your personal human perspective anymore, but seeing thru the eyes of Source and not acting as a human being anymore but as Source, Source acting thru you, consciously, when all is well in your world, that's what it means in practical terms, when the Infinite realizes itself as the Infinite thru the eyes of the Infinite, and that's the state of being I was getting at when I asked "Does anyone here feel invincible?" Because in those moments, you truly are. Good clean post.
I'm building a small fairyhouse for my SIL (although have stopped at present) inside a Tuart log of about 150 years of age. Been a dangerous project, working a anglegrinder inside the log without guard-on; never heard the story about that bloke
who's blade broke and a big peice lodged between his eyes. I came thro nicely only receiving a piece of Tuart in the eye. All good now.
Will send pic on Zins page when finished.
It has a Dome roof of tiny cedar shingles fixed to coiled sash cord that opens
to reveal the top floor which will have Bush Babies in seed pods,
the cord following the circumference of the log.
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Post by laughter on Sept 18, 2021 5:52:07 GMT -5
All thoughts are dualistic and therefore relativistic, but for those who can grok the absolute truth, it will be seen that life is one-with THIS and that the absolute manifests as that which is imagined as relative. The other morning I was driving to a construction site in mental silence (no voice in the head). No thoughts were necessary for driving the car or understanding (gnosis rather than episteme) what was seen. No thoughts were necessary for turning onto the correct roads, stopping at stop signs, and doing the trillions of things that a human body must do to intelligently and appropriately function. No reflective or reflexive thoughts were necessary for foreseeing anything, remembering anything, analyzing anything, or speculating about anything. Everyone functions like this throughout the day, but thoughts about the nature of reality and an incessant internal dialogue obscure the obvious. Bankei told people that they are all born with "The Unborn Buddha mind." He could just as well have called it "Absolute Intelligence." Bankei, of course, made a big mistake when he told people that they are born with anything because his statement implies that there is a someone who is born and a someone who has something. Haha. Anyone who looks deeply enough will see that twoness of any kind is an illusion. Twoness is solely a construct of imagination. But you could not have passed your contractors test to get your contractors license without conceptual relativistic truth, you could have earned a living. Yes? No? Could you direct your subs without language? Could you build a house without plans? (assuming you can't do all the work yourself). Could you go for a week with talking to your wife? No. Nobody can function in life (unless they are rich and can pay others to do necessary stuff like shopping) without relativistic truth, some conceptual dialogue. You couldn't have written your post to me without relativistic truth. If you isolate a child from learning language and interacting with people where relativistic truth is necessary, you'd pretty-much create a vegetable. The imaginary self is not a unicorn (like a unicorn is an imaginary creature, on earth anyway). Your questions are why I invented the "doooooofus guy" gag. They simply don't follow from what he expressed. There's no contradiction. The apparent contradiction is a product of mind - mostly intellect - trying to wrap itself around infinity.
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Post by laughter on Sept 18, 2021 5:56:34 GMT -5
It depends upon what things you're talking about. I actually built my first home totally without plans, and I've been building a lot of the current one without plans. Yes, it is possible to communicate with other people without abstract language, and in Zen interviews that is the dominant mode of communication-direct and unmediated by thoughts. In fact, Zen teachers begin by telling students to "leave your thinking mind at the door of the interview room and only bring your ''before-thinking mind here." Little children learn without abstract language, and we adults do also. Little children even learn the language of their culture primarily without abstract thought. Are there activities and subject matters where abstract thought and symbology are necessary or useful? Of course, but even in those areas a great deal of learning is intuitive or direct. I'm not denying that humans are conditioned to make abstract distinctions by their social environment, but those distinctions are both a blessing and a curse. As a curse they mesmerize people into thinking that they are separate volitional subjects in a world of separate objective objects, and none of that is true. Can you build a house without a measuring tape (numbers are abstractions)? Can you buy groceries without knowing the value of dollars? (money is an abstraction). Could you pay your electric bill without numbers? (Your meter tells the electric company how much electricity you used). (Almost) nobody could live for a week without abstractions, relative truth. Your truck driver had to know the value of money to buy food and gas. J Krishnamurti was the best at describing the utility of knowledge versus the chains of unnecessary self-centered-reflection. So, you can describe the act of taking the measurement with the tape, but that's after the fact. In the action, there needn't be any thought, just the doing. In fact, the quieter the mind, the more accurate the cut.
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Post by laughter on Sept 18, 2021 6:31:36 GMT -5
you and your godd@mned models! Lol, If you have been into traditional philosophy Laughter let me know. one of my sons may wanna relate.
Only ever had a passing interest wally, just my curious cat chasing laser pointers. But at this point, what can fascinate me is that particular point in a dialog where philosophy meets the ineffable.
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