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Post by silver on May 17, 2014 22:03:17 GMT -5
And so they bump their head??  You all but have it. What I was pointing to here was a hint. What does the hint point to? Already given: It always exists in the present moment. Already given: When it is missed, it isn't missing. Already given: There is ( this) something which you regularly do not experience the (non)absence of every day. You (E) earlier correctly translated this as there is ( this) something which you regularly do not experience the presence of every day. I earlier made the point that it is not that you never experience this, but that the shift from experience to non-experience is illusive. And the biggest hint that I was sure would seal the deal: In the film The Matrix, what did Morpheus and the others have to do to remove Neo from the Matrix? (IOW, how do Morpheus and the others move in and out of the Matrix when they choose to? Why are they different than Neo was previous to choosing between the red and blue pill? What did the red pill do?) If I am any more clear here it will no longer be a hint.  sdp Ooooooh! Just watching the movie it seems simple...until you start to think about it......Morpheus & co. had to retrieve him out of the real world /matrix physically. Morpheus & co. came and went by hooking themselves up electronically. How is this answering the *$^&% question?  |
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Post by stardustpilgrim on May 17, 2014 22:08:17 GMT -5
You all but have it. What I was pointing to here was a hint. What does the hint point to? Already given: It always exists in the present moment. Already given: When it is missed, it isn't missing. Already given: There is ( this) something which you regularly do not experience the (non)absence of every day. You (E) earlier correctly translated this as there is ( this) something which you regularly do not experience the presence of every day. I earlier made the point that it is not that you never experience this, but that the shift from experience to non-experience is illusive. And the biggest hint that I was sure would seal the deal: In the film The Matrix, what did Morpheus and the others have to do to remove Neo from the Matrix? (IOW, how do Morpheus and the others move in and out of the Matrix when they choose to? Why are they different than Neo was previous to choosing between the red and blue pill? What did the red pill do?) If I am any more clear here it will no longer be a hint. sdp Ooooooh! Just watching the movie it seems simple...until you start to think about it......Morpheus & co. had to retrieve him out of the real world /matrix physically. Morpheus & co. came and went by hooking themselves up electronically. How is this answering the *$^&% question? Yes. When you say him, what do you mean? You have all the pieces, put them together. But you have to know why you have the answer, that's the point. Read through my last long post again (but you can answer first, and then give the why). sdp |
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Post by silver on May 17, 2014 22:12:19 GMT -5
Ooooooh! Just watching the movie it seems simple...until you start to think about it......Morpheus & co. had to retrieve him out of the real world /matrix physically. Morpheus & co. came and went by hooking themselves up electronically. How is this answering the *$^&% question? Yes. When you say him, what do you mean? You have all the pieces, put them together. But you have to know why you have the answer, that's the point. Read through my last long post again (but you can answer first, and then give the why). sdp Him means Neo. This isn't getting any better, to be honest. I'm too confused to know what you're getting at, my friend.  |
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Post by stardustpilgrim on May 17, 2014 22:19:08 GMT -5
Yes. When you say him, what do you mean? You have all the pieces, put them together. But you have to know why you have the answer, that's the point. Read through my last long post again (but you can answer first, and then give the why). sdp Him means Neo. This isn't getting any better, to be honest. I'm too confused to know what you're getting at, my friend. OK, I understand. I just added a previously given hint concerning zd to the long list, when he sometimes refers to this, instead of saying I. When The Matrix began, we see Neo in his life, in the Matrix (but he didn't know, precisely, that he was in a Matrix, he knew something was wrong and was looking for an answer). You need to make the distinction between Neo, as consciousness, and what the Matrix was manipulating to make Neo think he was in the real world. You have the answer (all but), it might take a while to come to recognize the significance of the answer. One word, or two words. Three words at most. The ......... sdp |
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Post by stardustpilgrim on May 17, 2014 22:37:31 GMT -5
What was Neo at the most basic level? What are ~you~ at the most basic level, that which without, you couldn't be posting, now?
sdp
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Post by stardustpilgrim on May 17, 2014 22:47:48 GMT -5
You all but have it. What I was pointing to here was a hint. What does the hint point to? Already given: It always exists in the present moment. Already given: When it is missed, it isn't missing. Already given: There is ( this) something which you regularly do not experience the (non)absence of every day. You (E) earlier correctly translated this as there is ( this) something which you regularly do not experience the presence of every day. I earlier made the point that it is not that you never experience this, but that the shift from experience to non-experience is illusive. And the biggest hint that I was sure would seal the deal: In the film The Matrix, what did Morpheus and the others have to do to remove Neo from the Matrix? (IOW, how do Morpheus and the others move in and out of the Matrix when they choose to? Why are they different than Neo was previous to choosing between the red and blue pill? What did the red pill do?) If I am any more clear here it will no longer be a hint. sdp Ooooooh! Just watching the movie it seems simple...until you start to think about it......Morpheus & co. had to retrieve him out of the real world /matrix physically. Morpheus & co. came and went by hooking themselves up electronically. How is this answering the *$^&% question? It is the answer, you have the answer. But there is Neo as a self, a psychology, the consciousness Neo. And then there is Neo as ............ this thing they removed, you said the word, physically. sdp |
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Post by stardustpilgrim on May 17, 2014 22:50:02 GMT -5
Goodnight.
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Post by Deleted on May 17, 2014 23:10:42 GMT -5
What was Neo at the most basic level? What are ~ you~ at the most basic level, that which without, you couldn't be posting, now?sdp Fingers. |
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Post by laughter on May 18, 2014 4:05:19 GMT -5
Nah, Descartes just used idiom that is currently unfashionable. By "thought" he included perception and as far as causality ("Therefore") was concerned he included a back story to a creator to keep himself off the rack. I was suggesting a deeper ground, the basis for his claim, that, without which, he could make no claim at all. sdp Are you familiar with the line of reasoning that Renee went through to get to his conclusion? The interpretation of it has devolved into literalism over the centuries. |
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Post by stardustpilgrim on May 18, 2014 7:17:45 GMT -5
I was suggesting a deeper ground, the basis for his claim, that, without which, he could make no claim at all. sdp Are you familiar with the line of reasoning that Renee went through to get to his conclusion? The interpretation of it has devolved into literalism over the centuries. Hey laughter....I read it about 40 years ago in a course, From Descartes to Kant. We spent a long time on Descartes, and then others, ended up with only one day on Kant (ha). So yes, I know he didn't start with the cogito, it was a long process to end up with "I think, therefore I am". And yes, that probably doesn't sum up what he meant, but that's what I was referring to when I said Descartes got it wrong. Since I went as far as I did last night, I guess it doesn't do any harm to say that Descartes holds a lot of responsibility for this duality mess, the answer is 1/2 of his duality.  Does this mean you have the answer?  ...or not?  Someone that hasn't posted just chanced by ST's and is working on the answer.......so........ sdp |
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Post by stardustpilgrim on May 18, 2014 7:54:44 GMT -5
I was going to suggest a famous book on Zen, stories complied by Paul Reps and Nyogen Senzaki, the answer might be in it. But, maybe just read the ten zen ox-herding pictures.
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Post by Reefs on May 18, 2014 8:16:36 GMT -5
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Post by silence on May 18, 2014 11:51:24 GMT -5
That picture should be on the front of the forum pages. |
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Post by silence on May 18, 2014 11:54:26 GMT -5
To cut to the chase, this thread is a continuation of the Presence or Absence thread, a sort of Part B. So, the question remains, in ATA-MT, where are you? And in what sense are you? sdp The question doesn't remain here. |
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Post by topology on May 18, 2014 12:06:53 GMT -5
To cut to the chase, this thread is a continuation of the Presence or Absence thread, a sort of Part B. So, the question remains, in ATA-MT, where are you? And in what sense are you? sdp The question doesn't remain here. You did not respond in the form of 1, 2, or 3 words. Tsk, tsk, tsk! |
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...or not? 
