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Fasting
Jul 13, 2018 8:51:24 GMT -5
Post by Reefs on Jul 13, 2018 8:51:24 GMT -5
I've heard and read some really interesting things about the positive effects of fasting. Here are some interesting quotes:
"Fasting is the first principle of medicine; fast and see the strength of the spirit reveal itself." - Rumi
"I fast for greater physical and mental efficiency." - Plato
"Instead of using medicine, rather, fast a day." - Plutarch
"Fasting is the greatest remedy - the physician within." - Paracelsus
"Everyone has a doctor in him; we just have to help it in its work. The natural healing force within each one of us is the greatest force in getting well. Our food should be our medicine. Our medicine should be our food. But to eat when you are sick, is to feed your sickness." – Hippocrates
So basically, it has been part of our culture, actually any culture (and religion) for eons it seems. That kinda surprised me. So I gave it a try. I'm currently at day #5. So far so good. Probably going to wrap it up tomorrow. It served its purpose.
Anyone here who has some experience in that area?
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Fasting
Jul 13, 2018 15:34:37 GMT -5
Post by stardustpilgrim on Jul 13, 2018 15:34:37 GMT -5
I've heard and read some really interesting things about the positive effects of fasting. Here are some interesting quotes: "Fasting is the first principle of medicine; fast and see the strength of the spirit reveal itself." - Rumi "I fast for greater physical and mental efficiency." - Plato "Instead of using medicine, rather, fast a day." - Plutarch "Fasting is the greatest remedy - the physician within." - Paracelsus "Everyone has a doctor in him; we just have to help it in its work. The natural healing force within each one of us is the greatest force in getting well. Our food should be our medicine. Our medicine should be our food. But to eat when you are sick, is to feed your sickness." – Hippocrates So basically, it has been part of our culture, actually any culture (and religion) for eons it seems. That kinda surprised me. So I gave it a try. I'm currently at day #5. So far so good. Probably going to wrap it up tomorrow. It served its purpose. Anyone here who has some experience in that area? Yes, I have done 2 three day fasts (mostly for weight loss). OK until day 3, then pretty weak. Short on time now, back later. Presently doing 8 hour eating (basically intermittent fasting). You eat with an eight hour period every day. I actually have more energy, mind clearer, don't get hungry.
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Fasting
Jul 13, 2018 19:58:31 GMT -5
Post by laughter on Jul 13, 2018 19:58:31 GMT -5
I've heard and read some really interesting things about the positive effects of fasting. Here are some interesting quotes: "Fasting is the first principle of medicine; fast and see the strength of the spirit reveal itself." - Rumi "I fast for greater physical and mental efficiency." - Plato "Instead of using medicine, rather, fast a day." - Plutarch "Fasting is the greatest remedy - the physician within." - Paracelsus "Everyone has a doctor in him; we just have to help it in its work. The natural healing force within each one of us is the greatest force in getting well. Our food should be our medicine. Our medicine should be our food. But to eat when you are sick, is to feed your sickness." – Hippocrates So basically, it has been part of our culture, actually any culture (and religion) for eons it seems. That kinda surprised me. So I gave it a try. I'm currently at day #5. So far so good. Probably going to wrap it up tomorrow. It served its purpose. Anyone here who has some experience in that area? longest I've ever gone is 40 hours. What I've noticed is alternating intervals between a sort of energized, heightened awareness, especially of what Tolle describes as the "inner body", with intervals of distracted irritability and low energy similar to what Maxy described noticing when he went on Atkins. Funny how if I just go to sleep hungry the sleep is better and the hunger is gone in the morning. So I've had a superficial experience of the hunger breaking on it's own without satisfying it. Do the intervals between that and irritable craving get longer the longer the fasting lasts? Did you notice any sort of alterations in perception after the 2nd or third day?
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Fasting
Jul 13, 2018 20:53:49 GMT -5
Post by Reefs on Jul 13, 2018 20:53:49 GMT -5
I've heard and read some really interesting things about the positive effects of fasting. Here are some interesting quotes: "Fasting is the first principle of medicine; fast and see the strength of the spirit reveal itself." - Rumi "I fast for greater physical and mental efficiency." - Plato "Instead of using medicine, rather, fast a day." - Plutarch "Fasting is the greatest remedy - the physician within." - Paracelsus "Everyone has a doctor in him; we just have to help it in its work. The natural healing force within each one of us is the greatest force in getting well. Our food should be our medicine. Our medicine should be our food. But to eat when you are sick, is to feed your sickness." – Hippocrates So basically, it has been part of our culture, actually any culture (and religion) for eons it seems. That kinda surprised me. So I gave it a try. I'm currently at day #5. So far so good. Probably going to wrap it up tomorrow. It served its purpose. Anyone here who has some experience in that area? Yes, I have done 2 three day fasts (mostly for weight loss). OK until day 3, then pretty weak. Short on time now, back later. Presently doing 8 hour eating (basically intermittent fasting). You eat with an eight hour period every day. I actually have more energy, mind clearer, don't get hungry. Well, occasionally I had some weak moments, especially in the morning after day #3. But further into the day, energy level is always pretty high, on day #4 I actually felt like doing some weightlifting. So I did some push ups. Wasn't a big deal at all. So in a sense, fasting really teaches you something about metabolism and how food is absolutely overrated. This quote of U.G. comes to mind here: Gotta love that guy!
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Fasting
Jul 13, 2018 21:55:08 GMT -5
Post by Reefs on Jul 13, 2018 21:55:08 GMT -5
I've heard and read some really interesting things about the positive effects of fasting. Here are some interesting quotes: "Fasting is the first principle of medicine; fast and see the strength of the spirit reveal itself." - Rumi "I fast for greater physical and mental efficiency." - Plato "Instead of using medicine, rather, fast a day." - Plutarch "Fasting is the greatest remedy - the physician within." - Paracelsus "Everyone has a doctor in him; we just have to help it in its work. The natural healing force within each one of us is the greatest force in getting well. Our food should be our medicine. Our medicine should be our food. But to eat when you are sick, is to feed your sickness." – Hippocrates So basically, it has been part of our culture, actually any culture (and religion) for eons it seems. That kinda surprised me. So I gave it a try. I'm currently at day #5. So far so good. Probably going to wrap it up tomorrow. It served its purpose. Anyone here who has some experience in that area? longest I've ever gone is 40 hours. What I've noticed is alternating intervals between a sort of energized, heightened awareness, especially of what Tolle describes as the "inner body", with intervals of distracted irritability and low energy similar to what Maxy described noticing when he went on Atkins. Funny how if I just go to sleep hungry the sleep is better and the hunger is gone in the morning. So I've had a superficial experience of the hunger breaking on it's own without satisfying it. Do the intervals between that and irritable craving get longer the longer the fasting lasts? Did you notice any sort of alterations in perception after the 2nd or third day? Well, that wouldn't really count as fasting. Usually what they mean when they talk about fasting is about a week or so without food because it takes at least 3 days (depending on your diet) until your bowel is completely empty. And unless your bowel is completely empty, you can't really enjoy the full benefits of fasting. Now, that's what I've heard and read. It's not been my experience though. From a medical point of view, the logic behind fasting is this: So in a sense, fasting is some kind of reset for the body, and ideally also for the mind. There are many kinds of fasting. In the old days, they used to fast for 30 days, they would go into the woods or the mountains and spend their days mostly in prayer or meditation during that time. That's one extreme. The other extreme is that you just continue with your life as usual, you go to work and just do the things you usually do, except the eating. You just have to find your place between these two extremes. I basically continued as usual. I actually did fast for several days in the past. But I did it with willpower. And it wasn't really a pleasant experience. This time, I just felt like doing it and just did it. It's day #6 now and I probably could effortlessly continue another week but somehow I think this is going about it the hard way. It's a bit of what A-H call the 'action journey', i.e. you are trying to compensate something with action that can only be accomplished by vibration. And that's the thing that may go wrong with all the different dieting philosophies. It makes your life very conditional. And from my perspective, that's not the right way. What made it so effortlessly this time is probably my change in diet long before the actual fasting. Several months ago I was talking to my dentist friend again and somehow the topic of nutrition came up and he mentioned that he is on a strict non-inflammatory diet, basically 100% vegan. And he told me about the benefits of it. And I found that interesting. In the past, I already lived several month on a 100% raw diet and what he told me sounded quite similar. So I thought I should go back to a raw diet because I was a bit tired of being tired after eating. I basically settled for a 80% raw diet. I did some research about different diets and somehow came across fasting. Last month we met again and I mentioned the benefits of fasting, and to my astonishment, he said that he's quite familiar with the process of fasting. He actually did fast from time to time in the past when he was younger. At one time, he actually did it for 60 days (!), the first 30 days just living on pure water, the last 30 days getting by with an occasionally smoothie. He said he was really thin at the time, but felt great, full of energy actually, he even did go swimming regularly. So I thought I should really try this again, take it slow, just 5 days should do it as well. The first 1 without food wasn't an issue at all. If you are mostly on a raw diet, you'll eat very little anyway and an occasional feeling of hunger is an absolute non-issue. The second day went basically like the first day. On the third day, in the morning, as felt a little weaker than usual and was incredibly thirsty. I guess that's when the detox started. The fourth and fifth day were similar. I've read a lot about people feeling extremely hungry and even having cramps, or having severe mood swings and extreme headaches. I experienced none of this. Even today, I don't really feel hungry. And I had no headaches at all. I guess this is a very individual thing. If you are eating a standard western diet, then there may be a heavy detox going on. I experienced that when I first switched to 100% raw many years ago. You really need a strong character to get thru this. But when it's over, it feels like a new beginning. This time I only experience mild detox symptoms, probably because I was already on a mostly raw diet for more than a month. And about mood swings, there were the occasional low energy moments, but apart from that, nothing worth mentioning. Now, ironically, what you have to get prepared for is not your own mood swings, but the mood swings of the people around you, especially from those who love to eat and want to lose some weight at the same time. Suddenly you become their enemy! About sleep, I usually sleep well. So I can't really see a difference. What I noticed though is that the senses are keener and the mind doesn't seem to tire at all. About craving, I didn't experience that at all, probably due to the mostly raw diet before the fasting. However, on day #5 I had some thoughts about ice cream and big macs, haha. But nothing serious. Just funny. Those thoughts disappeared as suddenly as they came. About perception, a noticeable change started at around day #3, it's difficult to describe, but there was a new lightness to just being. Very nice. I didn't do any extra meditation or yoga though, I just went on with my day as usual, so I guess these changes could be more profound if that's the goal. My main goals was to get rid of an inflammation (which cleared up in less than 2 days) and also lose some weight. In that sense, it fully served its purpose. I got some strange looks from my wife though. So in that sense it was a bit counterproductive, haha. Bottom line: If you want to lose weight and have some minor chronic condition that just doesn't go away, then I can highly recommend it. But don't do it with willpower, or you will only have a miserable time. People around you eating and cooking will just annoy you. It will be self-torture. Do it as something you are really looking forward to and then it will be easy and effortless and you'll have a great time. People around you eating and cooking won't bother you at all. In fact, I did still occasionally prepare meals for my family as I usually do. And I didn't feel the slightest temptation to take a spoonful of whatever I was cooking there.
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Fasting
Jul 14, 2018 6:22:52 GMT -5
Post by lolly on Jul 14, 2018 6:22:52 GMT -5
There is a documentary, aptly titled 'Fasting', which covers a few different approaches to fasting, and the benefits of fasting as well as the potentially morbid and mortal outcomes. It includes interviews with relevant medical specialists, and people who have fasted. The documentary is well worth a look.
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Fasting
Jul 14, 2018 15:21:39 GMT -5
Post by stardustpilgrim on Jul 14, 2018 15:21:39 GMT -5
A couple of years ago I saw a PBS special on intermittent fasting. It basically dealt with it from the perspective of health benefits of calorie restriction (CR). The reporter looked at and tried three different ways. One was the 3 & 1/2 day fast, recommended no more than once a month (the 1/2 day is basically sleeping the last night). From experiments CR leads to longer life in mice. Another method was alternate days, eat normal one day, the next day eat no more than 600 calories ("fast" 3 days a week). I don't remember precisely the 3rd method, but it was something like eat normal 2 days out of three, fast the 3rd day. I didn't quite make it my first try. I was doing fine but I was doing a kitchen remodel on the 3rd day and the homeowners were getting take-out pizza for lunch and invited me to pizza. This was a pretty rare invite, so I caved in. Next try again I did fine, didn't get hungry. I walked regularly (2 miles) and continued. The 3rd day I felt physically weaker but walked with no problem. I still was not hungry the 4th day, but I had decided to do the 3 & 1/2 days so went back to eating. Oh, not eating period, for me, was easier than eating a little (tried also the 600 calorie "fast"). I have continued to experiment with intermittent fasting. About a month ago I found a cheap used book, The 8 Hour Diet. I've been doing that pretty regularly (mostly week days, weekends are harder). You eat all the food you are going to eat for a 24 hour period within 8 hours. Whenever you eat your first food you eat your last food no more than 8 hours later. I like to snack at night watching TV, so this commitment is a way to break that. About a year ago I discovered I'm on the borderline to being diabetic (too much sugar still in the blood after 8 hours fasting, your sugar should be below at least 100 after 8 hours fasting. That's one way to check. Another way is to see how fast/how much your sugar comes down after eating). So I started studying up on what to do to avoid having to take medication. Basically, no sugar, no bread (especially white bread, bread turns almost immediately into sugar after eating). No fruit juices (which have tons of sugar). Limit salt. No processed food. Limit restaurant eating. Another main factor is how much you weigh. So I lost 46 lbs in about six months. My blood pressure is also borderline high. When I got down to 190 lbs my blood pressure came to normal. At first I followed basically The China Study diet, no meat a part of it. I started eating some meat and gaining some weight back, my blood pressure started going up again. Looks like I'm going to have to totally cut out sweets (again) to lose the weight I've gained, my sweet ice tea is the hardest thing to drop. A guy I worked with over 40 years ago experimented with fasting. He said when your appetite comes back is a signal to stop your fast. I would not do a fast longer than the 3 & 1/2 days without more research. I'm sure ZD will eventually chime in, he has written before here about a disaster fasting, that was enough warning for me. From the PBS special they talked about a blood-work number that should be lowered for good health. One way to lower this number is intermittent fasting. Any of the 3 methods discussed on the program lowers that number. Off had I do not remember that term, I probably have it in notes somewhere. I think I recall that keeping that number low slows the aging process. The 2nd best book I found on loosing weight is called The Leptin Diet. A hormone called leptin basically controls our eating habits. So if you can control leptin, you can loose weight. This guy has five rules, which work very well. (One of the rules is eat breakfast, but he goes into that in the book. He says you can skip breakfast if skipping does not make you eat more later. So he is OK with the 8 hour diet). www.wellnessresources.com/news/the-five-rules-of-the-leptin-diet
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Fasting
Jul 14, 2018 16:06:32 GMT -5
Post by zendancer on Jul 14, 2018 16:06:32 GMT -5
Yes, extreme fasting (especially if combined with heavy exercise) can have serious effects. Long-term fasting as a weight-loss approach for people who are seriously overweight is also fraught with danger, and some people have actually gone psychotic due to a loss of particular electrolytes or necessary nutrients. There doesn't seem to be any problem with the kind of short-term fasting being discussed here, and fasting is occasionally pursued by Zen people on retreats who find that it increases their alertness and ability to concentrate.
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Fasting
Jul 15, 2018 5:15:11 GMT -5
Post by Reefs on Jul 15, 2018 5:15:11 GMT -5
There is a documentary, aptly titled 'Fasting', which covers a few different approaches to fasting, and the benefits of fasting as well as the potentially morbid and mortal outcomes. It includes interviews with relevant medical specialists, and people who have fasted. The documentary is well worth a look. I couldn't find it on youtube but I found this one instead (really good):
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Fasting
Jul 15, 2018 6:19:48 GMT -5
Post by laughter on Jul 15, 2018 6:19:48 GMT -5
longest I've ever gone is 40 hours. What I've noticed is alternating intervals between a sort of energized, heightened awareness, especially of what Tolle describes as the "inner body", with intervals of distracted irritability and low energy similar to what Maxy described noticing when he went on Atkins. Funny how if I just go to sleep hungry the sleep is better and the hunger is gone in the morning. So I've had a superficial experience of the hunger breaking on it's own without satisfying it. Do the intervals between that and irritable craving get longer the longer the fasting lasts? Did you notice any sort of alterations in perception after the 2nd or third day? Well, that wouldn't really count as fasting. Usually what they mean when they talk about fasting is about a week or so without food because it takes at least 3 days (depending on your diet) until your bowel is completely empty. And unless your bowel is completely empty, you can't really enjoy the full benefits of fasting. Now, that's what I've heard and read. It's not been my experience though. From a medical point of view, the logic behind fasting is this: So in a sense, fasting is some kind of reset for the body, and ideally also for the mind. There are many kinds of fasting. In the old days, they used to fast for 30 days, they would go into the woods or the mountains and spend their days mostly in prayer or meditation during that time. That's one extreme. The other extreme is that you just continue with your life as usual, you go to work and just do the things you usually do, except the eating. You just have to find your place between these two extremes. I basically continued as usual. I actually did fast for several days in the past. But I did it with willpower. And it wasn't really a pleasant experience. This time, I just felt like doing it and just did it. It's day #6 now and I probably could effortlessly continue another week but somehow I think this is going about it the hard way. It's a bit of what A-H call the 'action journey', i.e. you are trying to compensate something with action that can only be accomplished by vibration. And that's the thing that may go wrong with all the different dieting philosophies. It makes your life very conditional. And from my perspective, that's not the right way. What made it so effortlessly this time is probably my change in diet long before the actual fasting. Several months ago I was talking to my dentist friend again and somehow the topic of nutrition came up and he mentioned that he is on a strict non-inflammatory diet, basically 100% vegan. And he told me about the benefits of it. And I found that interesting. In the past, I already lived several month on a 100% raw diet and what he told me sounded quite similar. So I thought I should go back to a raw diet because I was a bit tired of being tired after eating. I basically settled for a 80% raw diet. I did some research about different diets and somehow came across fasting. Last month we met again and I mentioned the benefits of fasting, and to my astonishment, he said that he's quite familiar with the process of fasting. He actually did fast from time to time in the past when he was younger. At one time, he actually did it for 60 days (!), the first 30 days just living on pure water, the last 30 days getting by with an occasionally smoothie. He said he was really thin at the time, but felt great, full of energy actually, he even did go swimming regularly. So I thought I should really try this again, take it slow, just 5 days should do it as well. The first 1 without food wasn't an issue at all. If you are mostly on a raw diet, you'll eat very little anyway and an occasional feeling of hunger is an absolute non-issue. The second day went basically like the first day. On the third day, in the morning, as felt a little weaker than usual and was incredibly thirsty. I guess that's when the detox started. The fourth and fifth day were similar. I've read a lot about people feeling extremely hungry and even having cramps, or having severe mood swings and extreme headaches. I experienced none of this. Even today, I don't really feel hungry. And I had no headaches at all. I guess this is a very individual thing. If you are eating a standard western diet, then there may be a heavy detox going on. I experienced that when I first switched to 100% raw many years ago. You really need a strong character to get thru this. But when it's over, it feels like a new beginning. This time I only experience mild detox symptoms, probably because I was already on a mostly raw diet for more than a month. And about mood swings, there were the occasional low energy moments, but apart from that, nothing worth mentioning. Now, ironically, what you have to get prepared for is not your own mood swings, but the mood swings of the people around you, especially from those who love to eat and want to lose some weight at the same time. Suddenly you become their enemy! About sleep, I usually sleep well. So I can't really see a difference. What I noticed though is that the senses are keener and the mind doesn't seem to tire at all. About craving, I didn't experience that at all, probably due to the mostly raw diet before the fasting. However, on day #5 I had some thoughts about ice cream and big macs, haha. But nothing serious. Just funny. Those thoughts disappeared as suddenly as they came. About perception, a noticeable change started at around day #3, it's difficult to describe, but there was a new lightness to just being. Very nice. I didn't do any extra meditation or yoga though, I just went on with my day as usual, so I guess these changes could be more profound if that's the goal. My main goals was to get rid of an inflammation (which cleared up in less than 2 days) and also lose some weight. In that sense, it fully served its purpose. I got some strange looks from my wife though. So in that sense it was a bit counterproductive, haha. Bottom line: If you want to lose weight and have some minor chronic condition that just doesn't go away, then I can highly recommend it. But don't do it with willpower, or you will only have a miserable time. People around you eating and cooking will just annoy you. It will be self-torture. Do it as something you are really looking forward to and then it will be easy and effortless and you'll have a great time. People around you eating and cooking won't bother you at all. In fact, I did still occasionally prepare meals for my family as I usually do. And I didn't feel the slightest temptation to take a spoonful of whatever I was cooking there. That was a fun read. Sounds like some good advice too. The Loomis quote was as inspiring as it was informative. I guess some superficial and minor version of the enzyme repurposing is what I was referring to by reference to the "inner body". It fees like a positive, high-energy, non-audio physical hum. I ain't never had time for 30 days in the woods. I'm lucky with Sue, she's always on me to lose weight anyways, but then again she pushes food 'cause she doesn't like to eat alone.
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Fasting
Jul 15, 2018 9:59:32 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by stardustpilgrim on Jul 15, 2018 9:59:32 GMT -5
Just wanted to add one thing. If anyone stops eating meat (period) you have to take vitamin B12. Meat is the only source of B12 and it is essential for good health. Prolonged absence of B12 has nasty consequences.
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Fasting
Jul 15, 2018 11:07:45 GMT -5
Post by Reefs on Jul 15, 2018 11:07:45 GMT -5
Just wanted to add one thing. If anyone stops eating meat (period) you have to take vitamin B12. Meat is the only source of B12 and it is essential for good health. Prolonged absence of B12 has nasty consequences. I'm not really buying it. But just for arguments sake lets assume this is true. Now, I'm not advocating one or the other or condemning one or the other, just as a hypothetical that occurred to me while I was fasting, how many of us who eat meat would still continue to eat meat if they were only allowed to eat meat under the condition that they would have to kill it and prepare it all by themselves? Sorta like: "Here's your cow, here's a bunch of knives, good luck!"
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Fasting
Jul 15, 2018 13:27:42 GMT -5
Post by explorer on Jul 15, 2018 13:27:42 GMT -5
Humans really do not need to eat meat to live healthily. Excessive eating and meat-eating are examples in my view of unconscious and unreflective behaviour that is almost expected of us in the western world. People who fast or who refrain from meat are easily lampooned by a society that encourages consumption in general and eating in particular. I would say all the great sages and all the great teachings counsel moderation and self-discipline. Without self discipline of various kinds one can become lost among the thorns of the world (to echo Jesus' parable of the Sower) Personally I semi-fast every Sunday and never eat after 7pm, and my body is grateful for these small disciplines. It is not difficult to observe small disciplines if these disciplines become habitual. In the same way, observing the habit of regular silence is to refrain from gorging on words and opinions. May we all enjoy the blessings of moderation in eating and speaking!
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Fasting
Jul 15, 2018 16:04:10 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by stardustpilgrim on Jul 15, 2018 16:04:10 GMT -5
Just wanted to add one thing. If anyone stops eating meat (period) you have to take vitamin B12. Meat is the only source of B12 and it is essential for good health. Prolonged absence of B12 has nasty consequences. I'm not really buying it. But just for arguments sake lets assume this is true. Now, I'm not advocating one or the other or condemning one or the other, just as a hypothetical that occurred to me while I was fasting, how many of us who eat meat would still continue to eat meat if they were only allowed to eat meat under the condition that they would have to kill it and prepare it all by themselves? Sorta like: "Here's your cow, here's a bunch of knives, good luck!" I grew up in the country. My Grandpa raised chickens and sold eggs. I had three uncles within sight of my house who had dairy farms. I had another uncle who lived beside me who was a carpenter but also raised pigs. I never watched but I knew when it was time to kill pigs to make bacon and sausage. My brother-in-law hunts. You have to field-dress the game (gut). My son-in-law is a big hunter. While in the states all the meat they eat is game from his hunting. I've never seen an animal field-dressed either. But I think you are right, if most people had to kill and prepare their own meat, they would decide to like only vegetable protein. I read a book by Sri Yukteswar many years ago. He said the human body is not designed to eat meat. Animals that eat meat have a short digestive system so the meat passes through the system quickly. Humans have a long digestive system and meat begins to putrify before it completes the digestive process. Makes sense to me.
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Fasting
Jul 15, 2018 18:29:08 GMT -5
Post by laughter on Jul 15, 2018 18:29:08 GMT -5
Just wanted to add one thing. If anyone stops eating meat (period) you have to take vitamin B12. Meat is the only source of B12 and it is essential for good health. Prolonged absence of B12 has nasty consequences. I'm not really buying it. But just for arguments sake lets assume this is true. Now, I'm not advocating one or the other or condemning one or the other, just as a hypothetical that occurred to me while I was fasting, how many of us who eat meat would still continue to eat meat if they were only allowed to eat meat under the condition that they would have to kill it and prepare it all by themselves? Sorta like: "Here's your cow, here's a bunch of knives, good luck!" That's alot like asking "what would the monkeys do if all the trees suddenly went away?" or "how would google make money if there was no internet?". Peeps are a product of culture, and in terms of the biology of their bodies, there's quite a bit of variation. Lactose intolerance is a prime example of that. What would you eat if you were limited to eating what you could grow, and do you know how much land you'd need and where you'd get your seeds?
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