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Post by Deleted on Oct 1, 2015 5:54:12 GMT -5
Hey Jay...  Have you ever read TPON by Tolle? (just one suggestion.. there are hundreds of others.. just keep looking till you find an author which resonates) And there is a method called 'self inquiry' which most here would highly recommend.. (in fact I'd say it's essential) And I hear a commitment to meditation can be a useful exercise... And there are many members on this forum which have 'been there, done that', and would be more than willing to answer sincere questions (Laughter immediately comes to mind). As does Enigma, Reefs, ZD & Satch (among others). But, imo, your current MO of dissecting every sentence with long-winded madcap theories isn't likely to get you anywhere (or find many people here interested in engaging with those type thoughts) But first I think a person must become very clear about what they are looking for. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 1, 2015 14:50:57 GMT -5
nope  |
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Post by relinquish on Oct 1, 2015 16:36:22 GMT -5
Some of you may recall my Advaita with benefits thread back in July...seeking expressions from Advaitaists of the benefits they have obtained\developed from infusing this philosophy into their being. I enjoyed the discussions i had there. Well, i have a follow up one, and those that trust me, who perceive my inquiries are genuine, i hope will offer their thoughts on the matter. Duality of existence - namely, separateness, individuality, more than one consciousness exists. The exploration is regarding the pros and cons of things. Of course each person assigns their own value to things, thus what is considered a con to one, might be a pro to another. So it's not about determining who is right or wrong. Most of you know i currently do not see any benefit to my life by adopting the precepts laid out in the Advaita philosophy, and so that infers i could be classified as a Dualist, though i have never examined that philosophy to see what it's precepts are. But for argument's sake, let's say i am a Dualist, and in such i see the benefits of perceiving existence that way, namely i judge my separate individual self exists in a realm where i am intimately connected to all other separate forms. So, my inquiry is, what cons do you see in Duality, what is wrong with being a separate entity amongst all the other separate entities that exist in one space\realm...what harm does it do to oneself or other life forms? Firstly, just to subject your core premise to a little scrutiny before we go too far; If 'you' (Jay17) really are intimately connected to (and therefore inclusive of) all other forms (which is indeed true), in what sense are all these forms actually 'separate', other than merely SEEMING to be from particular finite, temporary points of view? |
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Post by relinquish on Oct 2, 2015 16:50:25 GMT -5
Firstly, just to subject your core premise to a little scrutiny before we go too far; If 'you' (Jay17) really are intimately connected to (and therefore inclusive of) all other forms (which is indeed true), in what sense are all these forms actually 'separate', other than merely SEEMING to be from particular finite, temporary points of view? Can you elaborate on this a little? The simple fact is that if an immense number of forms that lie beyond the physical boundaries of the form being called 'Jay17' were not there in PRECISELY the way that they are, the precise form of 'Jay17' as it is could not possibly exist in ANY sense at all. In this way, 'Jay17' fundamentally includes every one of those forms. In the same way, every one of those forms include immense numbers of forms that lie beyond THEIR physical boundaries, so 'Jay17' must equally include all those forms as well, and so on, ad infinitum. Let's not forget the boundless space without which the totality of form could not appear at all. 'Jay17' includes that as well. |
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Post by relinquish on Oct 2, 2015 17:06:22 GMT -5
Sorry. Can't figure out the split quote thingy.
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Post by relinquish on Oct 3, 2015 19:25:12 GMT -5
Sorry. Can't figure out the split quote thingy. I do it manually, that way i don't have to deal with a glitchy puta program. Regarding your post, it seems to me you have misunderstood the topic of this thread. If you desire to start a thread discussing pros of or evidence for nonduality, then feel free to do so, and i would join you in exploring it. This thread is about discussing the cons of Duality. Fair enough. To say that duality can have either cons or pros is like saying that the wavy surface of the ocean can have cons or pros. It's not good or bad. Duality (in this context) is simply a descriptive name for the explicit nature of Reality, which is the eternal effect of the implicit nature of Reality (which is itself absolutely causeless, boundless and self-experiencing). So the implicit causeless oneness is 'The Cause', and the explicit causal duality is 'The Effect'. Obviously, by definition, neither of these two can ever exist without the other, so there isn't really 'two' there at all. That is to say, Reality itself is neither explicit nor implicit. It simply is. Within The Effect can be found the duality of 'seer/seen'. These two are simply the two explicit faces of the self-seeing implicit one. Examples of 'seer/seen' are; 'emptiness/form', 'stillness/movement', 'changelessness/change' and 'order/randomness' etc. There are no objectively absolute pros or cons of seeing Reality as either duality or oneness. However, from the point of view of a wave that believes that all the waves (along with itself) are solely self-inclusive (i.o.w. that they are all fundamentally different, disconnected things), and therefore that it will one day be eaten up by the rest of the ocean and forgotten about, the realization that the true nature of ALL of the waves is in fact the one eternally seamless, perfect and complete ocean CAN come as one hell of a relief. (p.s, Please note that the description I have given you here is hopelessly inadequate, as all conceptual descriptions are forever doomed to be.) |
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