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Post by justlikeyou on Jun 20, 2014 20:27:22 GMT -5
A child, in order to really love and really appreciation a Parent, can not be programmed, forced or manipulated into giving love and appreciation, because then it would not have been freely offered and therefore would not be real. It may be me, but it seems that Source made a way for us to fall away and then to "choose" to return Home, to Him, Who like in the story of the returning prodigal son, comes to us with open arms, joy and blessings, while we are yet still far from Home. And I think we get a gold ring and a roast suckling pig or something too
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Post by enigma on Jun 21, 2014 2:49:27 GMT -5
You don't have to return home, as you never left. Hencely, love is always present, and is revealed in the absence of that which was never here. The innocence of a child, or a pet, gives us a glimpse of that absence.
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Post by Reefs on Jun 21, 2014 3:03:43 GMT -5
A child, in order to really love and really appreciation a Parent, can not be programmed, forced or manipulated into giving love and appreciation, because then it would not have been freely offered and therefore would not be real. It may be me, but it seems that Source made a way for us to fall away and then to "choose" to return Home, to Him, Who like in the story of the returning prodigal son, comes to us with open arms, joy and blessings, while we are yet still far from Home. And I think we get a gold ring and a roast suckling pig or something too That's quite a collection of misconceptions.
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Post by Reefs on Jun 21, 2014 3:30:10 GMT -5
You don't have to return home, as you never left. Hencely, love is always present, and is revealed in the absence of that which was never here. The innocence of a child, or a pet, gives us a glimpse of that absence. "It's here, looking me in the eye. It's here, here all the time." - Kim Wilde
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Post by tzujanli on Jun 21, 2014 5:58:16 GMT -5
A child, in order to really love and really appreciation a Parent, can not be programmed, forced or manipulated into giving love and appreciation, because then it would not have been freely offered and therefore would not be real. It may be me, but it seems that Source made a way for us to fall away and then to "choose" to return Home, to Him, Who like in the story of the returning prodigal son, comes to us with open arms, joy and blessings, while we are yet still far from Home. And I think we get a gold ring and a roast suckling pig or something too Children programmed to believe what their mentors 'think' love is.. 'Love' is a word that has as many different meanings as there are people that use the word, and some of those meanings differ by extremes.. considering the many and different understandings used as meanings, and the conflicts arising from attachment to those meanings, why not describe the condition being referenced with a clearer description? why insist that any one meaning is 'the' meaning?
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Post by justlikeyou on Jun 21, 2014 9:07:29 GMT -5
You don't have to return home, as you never left. Hencely, love is always present, and is revealed in the absence of that which was never here. The innocence of a child, or a pet, gives us a glimpse of that absence. Of course. I was speaking metaphorically. It seems, however, that few, if any, are born perfected with full knowledge of that Realization and I am suggesting a potential reason why that may be.
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Post by enigma on Jun 21, 2014 10:54:21 GMT -5
You don't have to return home, as you never left. Hencely, love is always present, and is revealed in the absence of that which was never here. The innocence of a child, or a pet, gives us a glimpse of that absence. "It's here, looking me in the eye. It's here, here all the time." - Kim Wilde The video's not available in the US, but yeah.
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Post by enigma on Jun 21, 2014 11:00:53 GMT -5
You don't have to return home, as you never left. Hencely, love is always present, and is revealed in the absence of that which was never here. The innocence of a child, or a pet, gives us a glimpse of that absence. Of course. I was speaking metaphorically. It seems, however, that few, if any, are born perfected with full knowledge of that Realization and I am suggesting a potential reason why that may be. And the reason that you are suggesting is so that a choice can be made freely for love, or something like that?
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Post by stardustpilgrim on Jun 21, 2014 11:22:34 GMT -5
A child, in order to really love and really appreciation a Parent, can not be programmed, forced or manipulated into giving love and appreciation, because then it would not have been freely offered and therefore would not be real. It may be me, but it seems that Source made a way for us to fall away and then to "choose" to return Home, to Him, Who like in the story of the returning prodigal son, comes to us with open arms, joy and blessings, while we are yet still far from Home. And I think we get a gold ring and a roast suckling pig or something too Despite the fact that you backed off this stated OP, a few posts down, this is essentially how I view our present circumstances. Non-duality would indicate that the "fall" is imaginary, the separation is not real. Source is source of life, but our identity passes into subjectivity, into duality. I consider it the case that what we say "I" to, where identity resides, so to speak (simply, one could say, [in] false self), has to make a real journey back, consciously uniting with Source. IOW, separate self is not merely an illusion that has to be *eliminated*, so to speak, by realization. The journey is a real journey. As for children and love, I've noticed that kids just learning to speak, say around two, will innocently say Hi to strangers. This is maybe genuine love and vulnerability. It very soon gets educated out of little ones. I think part of this reuniting with God as Source, is loving all mankind, even to the point of suffering ill effects sometimes. Those unable to love, are not really at fault, they have been educated to put self first, this is part of the formation of false self. Real love is being able to put yourself into the position of another, walk a mile in their moccasins. Thusly, you recognize the majority of their manifestations are automatized from the conditioned programming of false self, that is false self, IOW, what constitutes false self, so they can't think and act otherwise. To see this is to not automatically act in kind, but discover what love is. The greatest thing a parent can do for their children, is eliminate in themselves, such automatized functions as envy, jealousy, vanity, hatred and greed, among others, those things that, it so turns out, are what separate us from Source, anyway. These things are mostly passed on to our children, unconsciously. sdp
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Post by justlikeyou on Jun 21, 2014 11:32:40 GMT -5
Of course. I was speaking metaphorically. It seems, however, that few, if any, are born perfected with full knowledge of that Realization and I am suggesting a potential reason why that may be. And the reason that you are suggesting is so that a choice can be made freely for love, or something like that? From the POV of this existence, I see that some who choose to seek discover that what was sought was here all along, and in the discovery cry deep tears of laughter, appreciation and gratitude. Would such a thing be possible if the one seeking had been created perfected? I don't see how you can appreciate something if you've never experienced what seemed to be having been without it, illusion or no.
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Post by topology on Jun 21, 2014 11:42:37 GMT -5
And the reason that you are suggesting is so that a choice can be made freely for love, or something like that? From the POV of this existence, I see that some who choose to seek discover that what was sought was here all along, and in the discovery cry deep tears of laughter, appreciation and gratitude. Would such a thing be possible if the one seeking had been created perfected? I don't see how you can appreciate something if you've never experienced what seemed to be having been without it, illusion or no. What is appreciation? A healthy ripe peach tastes sweet. Are you saying that the sweetness cannot be enjoyed and appreciated intrinsically?
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Post by justlikeyou on Jun 21, 2014 12:11:59 GMT -5
From the POV of this existence, I see that some who choose to seek discover that what was sought was here all along, and in the discovery cry deep tears of laughter, appreciation and gratitude. Would such a thing be possible if the one seeking had been created perfected? I don't see how you can appreciate something if you've never experienced what seemed to be having been without it, illusion or no. What is appreciation? A healthy ripe peach tastes sweet. Are you saying that the sweetness cannot be enjoyed and appreciated intrinsically? Appreciation can mean many things but the way I am using it here is like this. I'm sure very few people have really considered the great value of having bottoms to their feet. We tend to take such things for granted. But if you lost them somehow then you might appreciate their value in a way you never had before. And if you regained by some medical miracle them you certainly would appreciate them in a way you couldn't have if you had never lost them.
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Post by justlikeyou on Jun 21, 2014 12:30:48 GMT -5
A child, in order to really love and really appreciation a Parent, can not be programmed, forced or manipulated into giving love and appreciation, because then it would not have been freely offered and therefore would not be real. It may be me, but it seems that Source made a way for us to fall away and then to "choose" to return Home, to Him, Who like in the story of the returning prodigal son, comes to us with open arms, joy and blessings, while we are yet still far from Home. And I think we get a gold ring and a roast suckling pig or something too Despite the fact that you backed off this stated OP, a few posts down, this is essentially how I view our present circumstances. Non-duality would indicate that the "fall" is imaginary, the separation is not real. Source is source of life, but our identity passes into subjectivity, into duality. I consider it the case that what we say "I" to, where identity resides, so to speak (simply, one could say, [in] false self), has to make a real journey back, consciously uniting with Source. IOW, separate self is not merely an illusion that has to be *eliminated*, so to speak, by realization. The journey is a real journey. I don't think I backed off the OP. I prequalified the word "choose" with quotation marks. If any one had asked me about it I would have said that it is not the person who makes a choice, there is no person to make a choice, but rather the choice resides in the agreement of the Soul with Revealed Reality.
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Post by topology on Jun 21, 2014 13:00:16 GMT -5
What is appreciation? A healthy ripe peach tastes sweet. Are you saying that the sweetness cannot be enjoyed and appreciated intrinsically? Appreciation can mean many things but the way I am using it here is like this. I'm sure very few people have really considered the great value of having bottoms to their feet. We tend to take such things for granted. But if you lost them somehow then you might appreciate their value in a way you never had before. And if you regained by some medical miracle them you certainly would appreciate them in a way you couldn't have if you had never lost them. And if being without them was not a negative experience, would there be that appreciation as a result of their absence? It sounds like the appreciation you are talking about is rooted in the aversion to the experience of the absence of the bottoms of your feet. Edit What I mean to say is that you are not really appreciating the presence of the bottoms of your feet. You are appreciating the absence of the absence of the bottoms of your feet. Appreciating the presence of your feet would be enjoying their look, enjoying the sensation you experience through them. Etc. No absence is needed to appreciate the presence.
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Post by justlikeyou on Jun 21, 2014 13:57:11 GMT -5
It sounds like the appreciation you are talking about is rooted in the aversion to the experience of the absence of the bottoms of your feet. I suppose you could say that a child's gladness to see his parents again after having been lost from them for a time is rooted in the absence of the angst of being separated from them. But the child, simple as he is, would likely say that he is just glad to be with them again.
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